en-us Thu, 02 Sep 2010 12:22:42 -0500 ATM@msgroup.org 60 *All Things Motorcycle* - Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/ *All Things Motorcycle* for Guest http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/ http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/rss_32.png *All Things Motorcycle* RSS Feed 144 47 Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Passenger killed on highway, no witnessesIgorhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12221&REPLY_ID=117158Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Wed, 01 Sep 2010 12:27:26 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12221 http://www.cbc.ca/canada/toronto/st...tion196.html

Ioana Bocunescu has been ID'd as the victim in this terrible incident. According to what I heard on CBC radio 1 she was 40 years old.

This is the only new information I've found. Obviously the SIU continues its investigation...]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Teen motorcycle racer killed in crash at Indyrayg50http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12229Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Mon, 30 Aug 2010 21:37:51 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12229
quote:

During a motorcycle race at Indianapolis Motor Speedway on Sunday, 13-year-old Peter Lenz fell off his bike during a warmup lap and was run over by a trailing motorcycle. A few hours later, Lenz was pronounced dead at a nearby hospital; the cause of death, according to the Marion County coroner's office, was blunt force trauma.

Though he was just 4-foot-11 and 81 pounds, Lenz was already a highly accomplished racer, according to the Associated Press. He earned "expert" designation from the American Federation of Motorcyclists by the time he was 11, and this year, competing in the U.S. Grand Prix Racers Union, he had already amassed four wins and five podium finishes.


http://sports.yahoo.com/nascar/blog...ascar-266149

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100830..._gp_crash_13]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Motorcyclist killed in suburban Will CountyRobushttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12217&REPLY_ID=117028Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Sun, 29 Aug 2010 20:00:38 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12217 Rayg, you are correct. Here is the actual intersection where the accident took place.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sou...9.96,,0,5.42

This morning we heard a knock on our front door. It was the daughter of our next door neighbor who informed us that the young man had been her fiancee, and that there was to be a wake this afternoon. Of course my wife and I attended. It was closed casket as he had been burned over 90% of his body.

Speaking to my neighbor at the wake, she was very unhappy at the quality of the reporting of this accident in the local press. She had visited the scene the evening of the accident and, as Rayg pointed out, there is no four-way stop. East-west traffic on Peotone/Church has a stop sign. North-south traffic on Route 50/Governor's Highway does not.

After the wake I drove out to the scene myself. The signs of the crash are still apparent. Based on my observations, here is what I surmise happened. The cyclist was eastbound on Peotone/Church as reported. A short distance west of the intersection, the road rises over a steep railway embankment and then descends down to the intersection. I believe the embankment obscured the rider's view of the intersection as he approached. Standing in the road and looking toward the intersection at about the eye-level of a motorcyclist, I could just barely make out the top edge of the stop sign. There is a sign warning of the intersection some distance farther back. Perhaps he missed seeing it.

As the motorcycle began to ascend the embankment, the rider caught sight of the intersection. By that point, it was either too late to stop or his braking technique was not up to task. The skid marks begin on the rising slop of the embankment and continue on the descending slope beyond the railway tracks. Somewhere toward the bottom of the slope or within the intersection itself the motorcycle went down and began to slide.

The truck that was northbound on Route 50 had no reason to stop. It was probably traveling at highway speed. There are deep gouges in the pavement where motorcycle slid into or under the truck. From that point there is evidence that the cycle was pushed or dragged about 70 feet to the point where it came to rest on the right hand shoulder of Route 50 northbound. Signs of the fire can be seen at that spot.

What a terrible waste of a young life. The rider had owned the motorcycle less than two weeks at the time he was killed. I am surmising that a combination of rider inexperience, inattentiveness, and perhaps too much speed caused this accident. A helmet probably would not have saved his life, but the fact that he was unhelmeted suggests an attitude toward riding that might have contributed to this tragedy.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - A friend of mine died this morning around 0200Night Trainhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12192&REPLY_ID=117000Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Sat, 28 Aug 2010 19:15:02 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12192 Well said CaptCrash. I personally dislike discussing accident situations when parties close to the victim are party to the discussion. When one is grieving, they don't always want to hear strangers opinions or are not as yet prepared to accept some of the realities of the matter. Emotions can run high and overwhelm rational thought. For those close to a victim, there is a time to rationalize but that is later in the grieving process certainly not before the funeral, and for some, not for a long time after that.

In this particular instance the death of Keith, regardless of cause, was a tragic loss for his family and friends, and two in particular that we are aware of, Staticattic, and Rob Andrews and to both these gentlemen, I extend my sincerest condolences as well as to Keith's other family and friends.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Another left turn accidentradan2http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12215Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Fri, 27 Aug 2010 22:53:17 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12215
The wreck occurred at Blue Creek Road near Falcon Crest Road at 7:22 p.m. Wednesday night, according to N.C. Highway Patrol dispatchers.

Arturo Martinez, 19, a Marine from Delano, Calif., was driving a 2004 GMC pick up truck west on Blue Creek Road and attempted a left turn into a private driveway when he turned into the path of a motorcyclist, said Trooper M.B. Davis with the Highway Patrol.

http://www.jdnews.com/news/road-819...k-creek.html

I am very familiar with this road. It is two-lane road lined with houses, businesses, and driveway entrances alternating with stretches of fields or woods. Sight distances are often very short. Traffic on it is very heavy at times. It was built as a rural road which has been gradually become congested as the city of Jacksonville has grown. I personally think that the speed limit (45 mph in many stretches) is high, especially during rush hour.

Clearly the driver in this case failed to see and think clearly about the motorcycle approaching him. One thing we need to keep clearly in mind is that it is harder for drivers to judge the speed of objects coming toward them, especially motorcycles. One of the main clues we use, the distance between the headlights, is gone. This is in no way to imply that the biker was at fault. He was apparently traveling in a legal manner when the car simply turned in front of him.

I know several people who live on that road. Some of them want the speed limit lowered, especially given the number of families with young children that live on that road or on subdivisions that feed onto it. Perhaps this accident will encourage the authorities to lower the speed.

This accident is simply a reminder of something that has already repeated been mentioned here: be extremely careful when you are traveling on a road where there is a driveway or road entrance to your right side, where an oncoming vehicle may turn onto it.

It also reminds us that even when we ride as carefully as we can, we can become victims of people that do not pay attention.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Rider dies two days after he high-sidesJames R. Davishttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12194&REPLY_ID=116874Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Tue, 24 Aug 2010 20:51:36 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12194 'Absolving' is not the issue. Instead, I wanted to point out that making assumptions about who was at fault based on a newspaper article is not possible.

I appreciate learning that 'pending charges' does not mean that the police have already decided that a charge would be made, though I expect that reading those words in a newspaper report of an accident leaves the reader thinking that charges will be made. And failing to yield the right-of-way or unsafe lane changes are INFRACTIONS, while 'charges' implies CRIME.

As to who is at fault ...

If a driver changes lanes when he believes it is safe to do so, and if he properly signals his intentions, and if by doing so nobody is FORCED into taking evasive actions to avoid a collision, then if an accident occurs, I would be hard pressed to find the driver at fault.

On the other hand, if another vehicle driver is FORCED into taking evasive actions to avoid a collision, then that lane changing driver is certainly at fault to the extent that he failed to yield the right of way or made an unsafe lance change. That does not mean that he is exclusively at fault, or even that he is primarily at fault. For example, if the accident could have been avoided by actions taken by the other driver, but those actions taken were inappropriate or none existent, then that other driver was also clearly at fault and it would be up to a jury or judge to determine comparative negligence in the matter. Similarly, if the accident could not have been avoided by actions of the other driver, because he was speeding, or he was 'under the influence', for example, then that other driver is also at fault and comparative negligence must be determined.

Nobody is expected to be able to use their brakes 'perfectly'. Everybody, however, is expected to use them properly - that is, with 'normal proficiency'.

Unless you know the facts, not just a simplistic and largely inaccurate newspaper account, you cannot come to any judgment about who was 'at fault' or to what degree.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Rider injured passing a tractorgymnasthttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12196&REPLY_ID=116818Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Mon, 23 Aug 2010 19:46:19 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12196 It is harvest time around here and the farm equipment, including trucks are thick on the local roads, many times taking more space than a 10 or 12 foot wide lane. Scott is spot on about not passing them when there is any potential turning place including unmarked entrances to fields that maybe only used a few times a year and may be difficult to see if you are not looking for them or familiar with the area.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Motorcycle Crash in Tampa 17 Aug 10staticattichttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12193Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Sun, 22 Aug 2010 18:34:07 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12193
http://www.baynews9.com/article/new...pickup-truck

It's not a new story, left turning vehicle colliding with a motorcycle, but I found the comments interesting. People are certainly quick to point fingers. This particular story involves a senior citizen driver and a middle aged rider.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Drunk Cop Crashes into stopped motorcyclesrayg50http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12146&REPLY_ID=116782Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Sun, 22 Aug 2010 17:57:01 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12146
quote:
Originally posted by MattInFla
if ... cleaned with isopropyl alcohol prior to the venipuncture, it is possible the specimen was contaminated and the result altered ...


Up until your added perspective I had been wondering who cares who had collected the sample. I now understand the reasoning behind dismissing charges based on that evidence. I do not like what is unfolding but at least I now understand this piece. Thanks.

]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Motorcyclists Crash into Camper - 1 Fatalstaticattichttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12180&REPLY_ID=116695Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Fri, 20 Aug 2010 12:48:21 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12180 I'm not a lawyer and I am unfamiliar with laws, but I didn't think an investigating officer could publicly assume who was at fault. In a crash scene, especially when a fatality is involved, doesn't a comment like that skew the whole investigation?]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Simultaneous left turns lead to collisionDataDanhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12185Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Fri, 20 Aug 2010 12:47:53 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12185 In Scranton, PA, a pickup driver turns left from Philo St. onto N. Main Ave. At about the same time, on the opposite side of Main 50 yards to the driver's left, a motorcyclist exits a gas station, also turning left. The two collide before the pickup has completed the turn, and the rider is killed.

One likely contributor to this crash is the failure of each to identify the other as a threat. The driver may have neglected to check left one last time before beginning his turn. The rider may have assumed he had been seen by the driver.

But another factor may have been excessive speed and rapid acceleration of the motorcycle. A car exiting the gas station would normally take about 6 seconds to reach the intersection (assuming 8ft/sec^2 acceleration up to a speed of 30mph). That would give the pickup driver enough time to complete his turn even if the other vehicle pulled out first. But a motorcycle, accelerated quickly, would reach greater speed and cover the distance in less time than a car. In fact the sportbike could have reached the intersection in less than 4 seconds. And in less than 3 seconds, it could have arrived at a distance and speed from which it would be impossible to stop.

A lesson for motorcyclists is to use the machine's acceleration wisely. Motorists accustomed to the capabilities of cars and trucks may not anticipate the threat posed by a hard-accelerating motorcycle.


To view the site of this crash, search Google Earth or Google Maps for 1102 Philo St., Scranton, PA. Street view at that location is the driver's viewpoint. Look north to see the gas station.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - A Mother's PainD Rhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12137&REPLY_ID=116677Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Fri, 20 Aug 2010 08:55:49 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12137
quote:
Originally posted by bachman1961


It seems like whenever the media rushes to post or report a story, often times the source involves speculation, early witness reports or other items that somehow get befuddled in the mix and not always accurate.

~brian




I have a unique opportunity with my job, which gives me access to those with the facts as well news reporting on various incidents around the U.S. It is appalling just how often the media gets things wrong. The journalistic ethos today seems to be that it's more important to be first with the headlines than to be first with accurate facts.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Motorcycle rides into the back of a Pickup truckTonicBIAhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12150&REPLY_ID=116505Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Sun, 15 Aug 2010 20:14:38 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12150 Distraction is everywhere. Heck, I have to WALK my bike when passing the DC mall in the summer/spring with all the sun bathing going on.

I love one of the MSF BRC questions about a minimum following distance being two seconds when conditions are "ideal". When was the last time you were on a bike at 100% capability, when you were 100%, the road was 100%, the weather was 100%, other drivers were at 100% etc?

It's pretty easy to get distracted and not pay attention for a second or two, especially over the course of a long ride. However, short rides are no exceptions with all the stresses of normal life. The best thing you can do is give yourself more time and space than you could ever need.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Crash in Iowa Kills 4 Motorcyclistsdpetrickhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12133&REPLY_ID=116386Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Thu, 12 Aug 2010 11:42:42 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12133 Last night one of the Sioux City TV stations had a feature on motorcycles and cars sharing the road. State trooper talked about wearing a helmet and driving defensively. They then cut to a video segment, cameraman on the back of a bike, and I could see that the driver of the bike was not wearing a helmet, as the video was shot over the drivers shoulder. So much for the advice the trooper had just given.
Very few of the riders they showed riding were wearing any protective gear. Yes the heat index was 102, but I see very few wearing any gear.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Another MC death in Houstonwegriffin8642http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12115Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Fri, 06 Aug 2010 20:26:25 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12115 Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Rider collides with cow and diesDaddiohttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12097&REPLY_ID=116155Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Thu, 05 Aug 2010 06:18:44 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12097 I have seen at least one other accident report about a rider/cow collision. I have hit a cow while driving a car and posted in that thread.

http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/t...OPIC_ID=8387

]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Saw a rider go downwegriffin8642http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12104&REPLY_ID=116117Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Tue, 03 Aug 2010 15:18:38 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12104 It's been my experience that the BRC does not "weed out" anyone. The lessons taught in the BRC and the ERC promote good habits about riding, but some folks will carry habits (good or bad) with them for a very long time. Since Texas enacted a law in September 2009 whereby the BRC is a necessary course for obtaining a motorcycle endorsement, many long time riders (formerly without licenses) too often demonstrate habits that can be troublesome at times. When I started riding (waaayyy back in 1960) I was told to never touch the front brake lever as it would throw me over the handlebars....and I carried that philosophy with me for a long time before I learned that it was not true.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Chilling implications of bicycle "accidents"Stevebr242http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12084&REPLY_ID=116081Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Mon, 02 Aug 2010 23:26:20 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12084 I've been a bike commuter for about 10 years, and have had my share of close calls and seen just about everything. Some really scary intentional stuff too. When I started riding motorcycles about a year ago, I noticed a lot of my bike skills rolling over to help with my motorcycle riding, particularly with "predicting" what motorists are about to do. It has saved me a few times. But I haven't had anyone intentionally menace me with a car yet.... It helps that my new commute is 20 miles on a bike trail in a green belt.

One of my favorite experiences on the motorcycle so far, though, was a 3 year old girl dragging her dad over to the side of the road at a stop sign so she could wave to me. I hope I have more of that type of interaction than the other.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - College student killed 'practicing'Lurfadurhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12078&REPLY_ID=116028Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Sun, 01 Aug 2010 13:29:59 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12078 Would adding a sort of "Trick Park" for motorcyclists be advised? Sort of like skate parks where there is a relatively safe place to do stuff and where there are usually other people around in case of emergencies. All you would need is a large portion of paved road and a fence going around it.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Save ducks, etcmjdfrhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11986&REPLY_ID=116020Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Sun, 01 Aug 2010 10:49:28 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11986 +1]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Today I bury a friendYoung Daihttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12064&REPLY_ID=115845Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Mon, 26 Jul 2010 15:59:46 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12064 Thank you for your kind wishes.

In the end over 150 riders were behind the hearse in the journey of 5 miles from church to the cemetery.

Not only from Roadcraft groups, but also a group from what I suppose you would call an outlaw patch club as well.(Cobra's MCC), Showing how Jane had touched a lot of people.

The roads on the route were closed off by Essex Police M/C Team,as a 'training exercise' without cost to the family

Once we got the cemetary ,the Cobra's decided they would not stay for Jane to be interred so they rode off just as the cleric began the graveside oratory from John 14.

Somehow the sound they made as they 'potato'd off into the distance complimented the occasion]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Motorcycle rear-ended - rider killeddhalen32http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=10145&REPLY_ID=115830Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Mon, 26 Jul 2010 13:16:46 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=10145
quote:
Originally posted by Donryu



For my membership dues and contributions to the AMA I wish they'd stop fighting helmet laws and start an information campaign on the dangers of distraction. Heck I'll even design the campaign for them.



Donryu:
What makes you think that the AMA fights helmet laws? As a safety professional, I wish that their offical position was in favor of helmet laws. I'm pretty sure that like many organizations and businesses they try to walk that tight rope of not offending either side in helmet law debates for fear of ticking off a portion of their membership.
Dave
]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Biker found shot dead after collision with deerbachman1961http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12050&REPLY_ID=115644Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Tue, 20 Jul 2010 01:50:46 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12050
quote:
Originally posted by haithabu

quote:
Carrying while riding, plus defective safety. Pistol goes off during crash. ???



.....causing a gunshot wound in the back of the head?


Possibly the exit.

~brian]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Pillion falls asleep, rider loses controlChicka_Deehttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12001&REPLY_ID=115463Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Thu, 15 Jul 2010 12:28:56 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12001
quote:
Originally posted by bostons

Id much rather sleep on the Harley.

As tempting as it might be to save a loved one from falling off the back of the bike, you're not doing them any favors in the long run unless you miraculously manage to save them while maintaining control of your vehicle. It's far better to control your bike and get it stopped quickly so you can be the first to call 911. This essentially makes you, the rider, the lifeline for the pillion who may be bleeding to death in a ditch. Every second counts! Otherwise you may have to wait for someone else to stumble upon the crash sight to make the call.


Some of the well-equipped touring bikes I see make we want to fall asleep just looking at the comfy passenger "couch".

Intellectually, I am convinced that maintaining control is the first priority. All of the comments supporting this view are very persuasive, and I was especially struck by bostons' reasoning regarding phone calls for help and comfort. I just don't think I could passively let a loved one fall, regardless of my intellect, and I suppose I am shooting for the miraculous save at some baser, wishful level.

As I don't ever plan to carry a passenger, the roads are pretty much safe from my reactions. But some emergency could arise where I had to carry someone on the back of my bike, and this discussion has raised my awareness of possible reactions that I would not otherwise have contemplated.

Oddly, I just realized that if I fell asleep and started to come off my husband's bike, I would not want him to do anything to endanger himself. I guess I just want everyone to keep themselves safe.

Part of my earlier post which I did not articulate, was that given a possible unsafe response by the rider if the pillion is at risk, it places responsibility on the pillion as well to not be a liability if possible (getting a stroke obviously is not in one's control).

An eye opening link, Razzoo. I am stunned to see how common carrying sleeping passengers seems to be. I admit I fell asleep once when I first started riding pillion, and before I was a rider myself. My helmet bumped against my husband's and I told him later I had dozed off. Since the bike was a little old Honda standard with no "couch" and not even a back rest, this was a risky event as my husband made very clear to me. Now when on one bike we stop for a break if either of us is feeling tired, and for us the headsets make the journey interactive and not as conducive to sleep--which does not seem to be the case for many of the riders with sleeping wives.[:u]]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Side by Side?CaptCrashhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12028&REPLY_ID=115461Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Thu, 15 Jul 2010 11:45:49 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12028
quote:
Originally posted by scottrnelson



I came close to rear-ending someone many years ago on a group ride while accelerating a bit too hard while pulling away from a stop, then realizing that the one in front wasn't accelerating nearly as much. I learned not to do that.


Ahhh...the Slinky Effect...hadn't considered it! Here's a recent example of trusting the guy in front too much?

IDAHO STATE POLICE NEWS RELEASE
Region 3 Patrol 700 S. Stratford, Meridian 83642
(208) 846-7550
Fax (208) 846-7520

For Immediate Release: July 12, 2010 10:15 pm
Contact: Tpr J. Sharp / Tpr J.Pattis

On Monday, July 12, 2010, at approximately 3:30 p.m., Idaho State Police investigated a one-vehicle rollover that occurred westbound on Interstate 84, just east of the Gowen Road exit.

Corazon Gildersleeve, 52 of Nampa, was driving westbound on the interstate, when for unknown reasons she went off the road. She then overcorrected to the left, where the vehicle rolled and landed on its top in the median. Gildersleeve and a 13 year old male were both transported to St. Alphonsus Regional Medical Center with non-life threatening injuries. Both subjects were wearing seatbelts and alcohol was not a factor in this crash. This crash is under investigation by Trooper J. Sharp.

Twenty minutes later, a secondary crash occurred at this same location. Miranda Sanders, 57 of Texas, was riding her BMW motorcycle westbound in the area of the crash. She was following behind her husband, also on a motorcycle. A Boise Police Unit was stationary in the left lane, providing traffic control for the first crash. Bruce Sanders swerved to avoid the patrol unit. Miranda Sanders was unable to avoid the patrol unit and struck the patrol car with the right side of the saddle bags on her bike. Miranda Sanders was transported by ground ambulance to St. Alphonsus Regional Medical Center with a broken leg. This crash is under investigation by Trooper J. Pattis.

http://idahostatepolice.blogspot.co...ds-with.html]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - C 470 - July 10 2010.Nightwatchmanhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=12015&REPLY_ID=115405Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Tue, 13 Jul 2010 23:06:45 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=12015 Nope. Wrong date.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Five people injured, 1 motorcycle, 1 garden tractor, 1 deadYoung Daihttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11988&REPLY_ID=115165Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Tue, 06 Jul 2010 14:52:51 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11988
quote:
Originally posted by DataDan

Not to make light of the tragedy, but this is the 4th motorcycle-vs.-lawnmower crash in the news in the past month, and the 3rd death. Very strange. [?]

One crash occurred in WY when the mower rider was crossing the street (high speed of the motorcycle is alleged), one in MN when the mower rolled off a trailer being towed in traffic, and one in FL on a freeway rest area offramp (no further details).


Perhaps they all think they are out of Straight Story : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Straight_Story

The trouble is that one man's tenacious folk hero, is another's pain in the a55.

You loose your licence so you climb on a slower vehicle and putter off into fast moving traffic , gleaming idea.
]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Yet another left-turn crash configurationscottrnelsonhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11985&REPLY_ID=115160Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Tue, 06 Jul 2010 12:02:34 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11985 I just returned from Utah this morning. I was driving there yesterday and was in a similar situation as the second turner at one of those yield-on-green lights on what I consider one of the most dangerous streets in Salt Lake Valley for motorcycles.

I wanted to get the left turn done as soon as possible, but couldn't clearly see what was coming through the car ahead. I was thinking about this very issue, wondering if any oncoming traffic could at least see my turn signal at the front corner of the car to realize that there was added risk of a second turner. As it turned out, I made sure there was absolutely nobody coming before making my turn, but I can see how easy it would be to miss a motorcycle in just the wrong spot coming along right after the first car makes its turn.

We can't get all other drivers to drive intelligently all of the time, so we have to spot the risks as motorcyclists and do what we can to keep out of danger. Left turners are often one of the biggest dangers in city and residential areas, especially in areas where there are not separate turn lanes and separate traffic lights for those turn lanes as is usually the case where I live.

And on a separate but related note, I saw several dozen motorcycles and scooters in Utah, and a total of four riders were wearing helmets. Not a very good safety record for that state.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Asleep, Crash, No Helmet = FatalityThe Postmanhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11973&REPLY_ID=115150Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Tue, 06 Jul 2010 09:16:35 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11973 Another rider has lost his life trying to complete this quixotic race. This is one case where I would be happy if some money hungry attorney can find a loop hole to sue for some good money.

I agree the onus lies on the riders to look out for their own safety however the organizers did not exhibit common sense.

http://msn.foxsports.com/other/stor...-race-070510]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Cyclist's body not found for days after accidentCash Anthonyhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11983&REPLY_ID=115081Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Fri, 02 Jul 2010 13:57:03 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11983 If you ride with a group who become tight-knit friends, it's not uncommon for someone to call to see if you get home safely, after you've split paths to your own destination.

Maybe not every ride, but if it's the end of a long trip, everyone's tired, or the weather is dicey.

That's one benefit of not being a solo rider all the time, even if that's your personal preference for the most part.

Filing a flight plan for any ride where you aren't going to be in easy reach of help and 'civilization,' with someone who expects you to come back at a certain time, is just common sense.


Cash]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Saves Ducks--Riders KilledDonryuhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11978&REPLY_ID=115079Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Fri, 02 Jul 2010 11:10:19 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11978 A lesson here for both riders and drivers I think. Not to place any blame on the riders, since the articles don't provide enough information to evaluate what actually happened, but a stopped vehicle around a blind curve could indicate the riders were driving faster than their forward sight allowed for stopping.

For drivers, and I know how horrible this may sound to some, when you encounter a small animal on the road, unless you can avoid it without causing a dangerous situation, you should maintain your safe line of travel, even if it means hitting the small animal.

Obviously, this is not the way to deal with any obstacle larger than a dog which can do a heck of a job on a car, but the alternative of swerving into another lane or causing an accident such as the one described above is far more costly.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Fatal crash due to rumble strip?gymnasthttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11877&REPLY_ID=114972Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Tue, 29 Jun 2010 22:01:54 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11877 IronHenry, I think he was going faster than you were and that the rumble strips cited in the news story were only coincidental to the cause of the crash and the ultimate fatal outcome.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - A bad oneDonryuhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11602&REPLY_ID=114971Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Tue, 29 Jun 2010 21:34:50 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11602 My prayers go out to the riders' families and firends. The trucker will have to make his own peace.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Woman crashes her bike in her own drivewayIronHenryhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11790&REPLY_ID=114969Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Tue, 29 Jun 2010 19:53:03 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11790 Burn-out gone bad? Seen it happen.

Maybe she thought it was in neutral and dumped the clutch, rolled on the throttle when the bike lurched and then froze up. Seen that as well.

Very unfortunate that she didn't survive.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - 5 Killed When Motorcycle, Van CollideDataDanhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11971&REPLY_ID=114957Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Tue, 29 Jun 2010 11:49:30 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11971 Though the investigator's description of the crash hasn't yet been released, an account today from a police source differs from the one that appeared yesterday.

The motorycles were reportedly southbound, on the leg of the Y going toward the junction, and the van was northbound (from which fork is not reported), and the collision occurred in the southbound lane.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Here is real NOTGAATDonryuhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11904&REPLY_ID=114776Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Thu, 24 Jun 2010 17:57:24 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11904 I realize I'm a bit late to this thread and it's been said many, many, many times before but driving anything drunk, HONESTLY.

I'm sure there are more than a few current or former law enforcement professionals on these forums, and as a former highway patrol officer I've seen the damage at too many fatality scenes and the devastation drunk drivers cause families to have any remaining tolerance for them.

I would like see a true zero tolerance policy for drunk drivers; first offence, felony conviction and mandatory jail time along with a ten year loss of all driving privileges follwed by a long and difficult process for reinstatement (including some type of counseling). Second offence, felony conviction mandatory jail time and a permanent loss of driving privileges.

I cannot think of a single reason to operate a vehicle while drunk, it's a choice pure and simple.
]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Boy meets elk, RIPThe Postmanhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11947&REPLY_ID=114757Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Thu, 24 Jun 2010 12:56:23 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11947
quote:
Originally posted by haithabu


The young man was riding back from Calgary at around 1:00 am when it happened. There is a wildlife crossing sign near where the accident took place, though I have never seen any in the hundreds of times that I have been past that stretch.

It had been raining, and with the wet road and darkness visibility would have been poor.


Very sad the loss of a life, particularly a young one. I pray for strength for his loved ones.

This is one of the reasons why I don't ride at night. Too much going on.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Motorcyle kills Pedestriangymnasthttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11941&REPLY_ID=114747Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Wed, 23 Jun 2010 18:23:05 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11941 Here is what went down in South Dakota when a former Governor and sitting US Congressman ran into a motorcyclist.

http://motorcyclecruiser.automotive...h/index.html

]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Another variation on the motorcycle vs. left-turner crashRobushttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11912&REPLY_ID=114570Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Thu, 17 Jun 2010 01:13:32 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11912 Good video. The key thing was that he saw the gap in traffic and anticipated that a car might come through it. He was already slowing before he actually saw the left turner.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - so?? you want to go on a charity ride??The Postmanhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11881&REPLY_ID=114418Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Fri, 11 Jun 2010 19:14:37 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11881
quote:
Originally posted by Robus

[quote]
I think you misunderstood me. I was referring to the driver who ran over the police officer.


Sorry I clicked on Scotts link and thought you were referring to that Police Officer. My apologies [:I][:I]]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Don't be the First One into the Intersection - VideoWSMedershttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11722&REPLY_ID=114407Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Fri, 11 Jun 2010 08:21:05 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11722 Anyone know if the speeding/red light cameras are sensitive enough to catch a motorcycle?
Not that I'm dreaming of runnin' lights, but as Robus pointed out, us two-wheelers sometimes get stuck.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Weird accident...bachman1961http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11663&REPLY_ID=114399Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Fri, 11 Jun 2010 04:29:32 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11663
quote:
Originally posted by Night Train

This whole situation plays out like a "Scenario of Stupidity" on the part of all concerned.


No doubt.

I'd probably put an ad in the paper saying I found some nice shoes in that general vicinity that don't fit me. Call to describe them and you can claim your shoes if you want them.

They might just be goofy enough to fall into my Sting operation so LEO can nab the Moto-Bozo. [88]

~brian]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Painting her nailsRobushttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11145&REPLY_ID=114396Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Fri, 11 Jun 2010 01:46:38 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11145 This accident happened up here in Chicagoland last year and made headlines nationwide.

This grandmother seems to genuinely remorseful and will probably go to prison, as she probably should do. I can't help but see her imprisonment as just another tragedy in a case overflowing with them.

The lesson is this: Nobody on her first drive ever would think of painting her fingernails behind the wheel. That level of stupidity speaks of a habit of complacency that has taken root over many years. We see the same thing all the time: drivers distracted, talking on their cell phones, concentrating on ANYTHING but what they are doing. The longer they get away with it, the more complacent they become. Occasionally one of them kills somebody. The others keep going on, as complacent as ever.

Nothing will ever get through to them. We can punish his woman, but we cannot make an example of her. That is because the complacent masses are not paying attention to examples. They don't read news reports of accidents and think "what lesson can I learn from this?" If they did, they would not be complacent in the first place. They are oblivious, unteachable, and a fact of the road that we must face.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Tumbling diceRobushttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=10980&REPLY_ID=114394Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Fri, 11 Jun 2010 01:02:54 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=10980 Glad to hear that the two of you are on your way to a full recovery. Congratulations on your new ride.

Interesting that your crash was almost identical to gdickelman's. If his account didn't bring the lesson home, then your's sealed it: See a gap in a line of traffic, expect something to be coming through it.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - U-Turn FiascoCaptCrashhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11875Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Mon, 07 Jun 2010 07:56:16 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11875 http://www.idahostatesman.com/2010/...ured-in.html

It's a bit sketchy and the obvious lesson is to be sure the road is clear when you initiate a u-turn. The NOT so clear lesson may be this:

The Alt-MOST and the MSF test for a 20 or 24 foot U-turn. Why? Because with a 10 foot wide lane and a couple of feet past the fog lines a road can be between 20 and 24 feet wide. Making a Y turn on a public road exposes you to all kinds of dangers! You end up trying to back pedal your bike back UP a crown, you're stopped in the lane of traffic AND there's no real escape except to launch your bike into the bushes.

Lesson? Practice your U-turns.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Truck swerves into side of motorcycleThe Meromorphhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11838&REPLY_ID=113945Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Sun, 30 May 2010 15:08:17 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11838 One possibly pertinent issue is that it is illegal (and considered outrageous) in Germany to pass on the right.
My youngest learned to drive in the US, then almost immediately moved to Germany for 8 years (with the US Army). His first day back in the US, he was driving on the freeway in his car, at the speed limit in the center lane of 3, and a car came up at high speed on the inside lane. Like a good german driver, he immediately signaled and moved over to the inside lane, to allow the faster vehicle to pass (because of course no-one would pass on the right!). Both cars lost a wing mirror, but no other damage occurred. He was incensed and outraged that a) anyone would pass on the right, and b) it was legal to do so in the US.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Another oneTecpatl4http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11828Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Thu, 27 May 2010 17:00:40 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11828
It's time for planting. Those huge tractors are all over the place, and people get frustrated waiting for them and are liable to do strange things.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - 69 year old Cove man killed on a 2010 wingNight Trainhttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11684&REPLY_ID=113832Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Wed, 26 May 2010 04:21:04 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11684 I think the rule referred to applies to new riders when buying their first bike. Don't ride it home from place of purchase. Trailer it, truck it, have it delivered, or ridden by an experienced friend. Then do PLP to get to know the bike before taking it out on the road.

Even experienced riders will ride their new bike somewhat gingerly until they become comfortable and familiar with it. At least, that is what I do.

I don't know if the rider in question was a new rider or not, or if he just purchased something larger than he could handle.]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Rule #1SkootchNChttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11801&REPLY_ID=113800Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Tue, 25 May 2010 06:27:32 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11801 Returning to a motorcycle- safety class after lunch, two police officers crashed their bikes into each other in Jefferson County on Thursday afternoon.

The officers one from Lafayette, the other from Northglenn were thrown from their motorcycles when one bike clipped the other as a group of more than 30 motorcycle cops was getting onto C-470 at West Ken Caryl Avenue about 12:30 p.m., according to the Colorado State Patrol.

They MAY have sideswiped each other, or had their handlebars "tangle" or? ran into the back of the bike in front. I know motor officers are proud of their skills, but they are still human, and yes, they DO make mistakes]]>Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS - Act in haste, repent at leisure.bostonshttp://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?whichpage=-1&TOPIC_ID=11780&REPLY_ID=113491Motorcycle Accident Reports - WITH COMMENTS Fri, 14 May 2010 22:25:34 -0500http://www.msgroup.org/forums/mtt/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11780 Agreed. The only time I ever feel totally comfortable passing anyone is when I'm on a bridge.]]>