(Please visit one of our advertisers)

No donations or subscriptions are required

   OR   
   
Subscription choices:
Board Karma = 40  (3488 positive of 3870 votes is 40 %pts higher than a neutral 50%)
All Things (Safety Oriented) Motorcycle   
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?

You can the entire collection of Safety Tip articles in a 33 Megabyte PDF Portfolio

 All Forums
 Motorcycle Safety
 Rider Training Courses
 Harley Davidson Revamps Rider Training
Member Previous Topic Discussion Topic Next Topic  

gymnast
Moderator
4263 Posts
[Mentor]


Meridian, Idaho
USA

Harley-Davidson

Sportster Sport

Posted - 06/24/2014 :  11:49 PM                       Like
Via the Kneeslider

Harley Davidson is taking a new run at rider training with their Harley Davidson Riding Academy. One of the changes, besides the name, is students will learn to ride on the Harley-Davidson Street? 500, a great beginner's bike and something they might want to keep riding after they finish the course.

Even though it's a pretty forgiving bike to start out on, it will be set up just for students:

Additional features developed specifically for use in the Harley-Davidson Riding Academy include an industry-first Power Limit Calibration that puts a ceiling on the vehicle?s low-gear speeds, allowing only the maximum rate a student needs in the course, and a unique Vehicle Protection Kit that allays student fears of damaging the vehicle in a tip-over.

Sure, Harley hopes students will buy a bike when the course is over, but until now, training on a Harley hasn't been easy, even a Sportster would be a bit much for the average new rider, but these new Street 500s, especially when set up as described above, make for an easy entry into motorcycling.

Rider training is a good thing and giving new students the chance to learn on a Harley could be a nice boost for the Motor Company, too. It's a win-win. I like it.

You still need to remember, though, rider training never ends.

Press release follows:

HARLEY-DAVIDSON AMPS UP RIDER TRAINING WITH LAUNCH OF HARLEY-DAVIDSON RIDING ACADEMY
After Successfully Training More Than 350,000 New Riders Over 14 Years, Program Expands Globally with New Experiences, New Motorcycle and New Name

MILWAUKEE (April 24, 2014) ? Pumping the adrenaline ? by learning to ride a motorcycle ? just got a lot cooler, not to mention more fun. For the first time ever, those dreaming of riding can now learn on a genuine Harley-Davidson? motorcycle.

Today, the company unveiled the new Harley-Davidson? Riding Academy ?the only national rider training program hosted by Harley-Davidson? dealerships and conducted on an all-new Harley-Davidson? motorcycle.

?For years we?ve been delivering a life-changing, freedom-inspiring training experience,? said Angela Thundercloud, Harley-Davidson Rider Training Manager. ?Now, we?re taking rider training to a new level by incorporating a Harley-Davidson motorcycle that students will want to keep riding long after class is over.?

Designed to Instill Confidence
There is nothing like the independence of the open road. Since its inception in 2000, Harley-Davidson?s rider training program has successfully trained more than 350,000 new riders with a premium Motorcycle Safety Foundation (MSF)-approved rider training experience that guides students on their journey from the classroom to the street with an emphasis on building student confidence on their road to independence.

The Harley-Davidson Riding Academy?s New Rider Course provides nearly everything students need to take the first step on their motorcycle riding journey, including MSF-certified instructors, use of a motorcycle to learn on, and a minimum of 20 hours of combined classroom and range training with a guaranteed 6:1 student/instructor ratio. All students need to bring to class is appropriate riding gear.

Harley-Davidson Riding Academy students will learn to ride on the new Harley-Davidson Street? 500 motorcycle. Its confidence-inspiring handling and agility, smooth powertrain and authentic Harley-Davidson Dark Custom styling not only appeal to young, urban riders around the world, but also make it an ideal vehicle for learning to ride.

Additional features developed specifically for use in the Harley-Davidson Riding Academy include an industry-first Power Limit Calibration that puts a ceiling on the vehicle?s low-gear speeds, allowing only the maximum rate a student needs in the course, and a unique Vehicle Protection Kit that allays student fears of damaging the vehicle in a tip-over.

?Instilling confidence is vital to preparing new riders to move from the classroom to the open road,? Thundercloud said. ?We designed everything ? the experience, the curriculum and the equipment ? to inspire that needed confidence and empower new students to have a ton of fun learning to ride on a Harley-Davidson motorcycle.?

In many states, completion of a Harley-Davidson Riding Academy course can exempt riders from needing to take an additional road test before becoming licensed, and many insurance providers offer discounts to graduates.

To learn more about Harley-Davidson Riding Academy, or to find a participating dealer, visit Harley Davidson Riding Academy.


http://thekneeslider.com/harley-dav...er-training/

James R. Davis
Male Administrator
17283 Posts
[Mentor]


Houston, TX
USA

Honda

GoldWing 1500

Posted - 06/25/2014 :  7:47 AM Follow poster on Twitter  Join poster on Facebook as Friend  
Whatever is happening in the motorcycle world? Rational, common sense, curriculum changes along with a reasonable motorcycle to learn on, and a name change that emphasizes learning instead of 'testing limits' - I've just become an advocate instead of a critic of the H-D sales effort and training program.

I will certainly watch the results of this series of changes as closely as I did the Rider's Edge approach, but I'm already willing to suggest that the new program is probably NOT THIRTY-FIVE more dangerous than the MSF's BRC for new riders to attend.

I like what I see. Bravo to the creators of this more responsible approach!!!
Go to Top of Page

dhalen32
Male Moderator
841 Posts
[Mentor]


Omaha, NE
USA

BMW

R1200RT

Peer Review: 1

Posted - 06/27/2014 :  6:17 AM
Jim:
As you know I work both HDRA and MSF classes and I have never been comfortable with your blanket assertion that Rider's Edge was 35X more dangerous than an MSF class. H-D has provided us with a new training machine that makes it much more compelling to use than the Blast. See my related post on my first impressions of the new Street 500 WITH a vehicle protection kit installed.

I too am hopeful that this new machine will provide a more satisfactory experience for our new student riders. However, it is not a silver bullet. Poor coaching, "tight" ranges and student panic will all still be contributing factors to crash rates, injuries and even fatalities during rider training.

Our favorite subject, motorcycle riding, is still a risky activity that people should not casually attempt. It takes someone with a serious safety mindset to undertake learning how to ride and then operate in an increasingly congested, distracted environment in 2014 and beyond.

Remember, H-D still uses the same MSF curriculum that the rest of the training providers use every weekend of the training season. HDRA adds some really good stuff in the classroom but the range exercises are identical except for the addition of targeted "journaling" moments every hour or so between riding exercies.

I do not disagree that H-D has taken a VERY positive step with our new training vehicle but press releases aside, not much else has changed. How a program is run at a dealership, range conditions and how effectively the state motorcycle program keeps RiderCoaches on the same page is probably more important in determining how safe and effective the training will be.

I hope this post is not construed as being too negative. I just wish to urge caution and patience to wait and see what sort of results we get in the field. With a new HDRA training bike and the new MSF BRC curriculum in 2015 I am hopeful that we will see increasingly postive outcomes at our programs and on the highways here in Nebraska and Iowa.
Respectfully,
Dave
Go to Top of Page

gymnast
Moderator
4263 Posts
[Mentor]


Meridian, Idaho
USA

Harley-Davidson

Sportster Sport

Posted - 06/27/2014 :  11:37 AM
Dave, well considered thoughts and wise council.
Go to Top of Page

dhalen32
Male Moderator
841 Posts
[Mentor]


Omaha, NE
USA

BMW

R1200RT

Posted - 06/29/2014 :  1:35 PM
Thanks Gymnast!
Dave
Go to Top of Page

James R. Davis
Male Administrator
17283 Posts
[Mentor]


Houston, TX
USA

Honda

GoldWing 1500

Posted - 06/29/2014 :  2:06 PM Follow poster on Twitter  Join poster on Facebook as Friend  
quote:
"... your blanket assertion that Rider's Edge was 35X more dangerous than an MSF class."


Make no mistake, that was not just an opinion of mine. I documented that this was the case based on the numbers of fatal and near fatal accidents that occurred in RE classes versus BRC classes divided by number of students in each. At least by that measurement, the RE classes WERE 35 times more dangerous.

Over time, I'm sure, that number has come down.

Let's say it has come all the way down to only being twice as dangerous for a student to take a RE class as compared to an MSF BRC. Would you feel better, as a result, about recommending a H-D class instead of an MSF class to a newbie?

I worked a court case in which a prospective RE student claimed on her enrollment application that she did NOT know how to ride a bicycle, yet she was enrolled anyway. On the first day she was encouraged to say that she 'could' ride (as she had when she was a child) and let her into the class.

On her first range day, she dropped the bike during an exercise with minor injuries. One of the instructors helped her up and asked if she wanted to continue - she did and was allowed to do so. She had claimed that she had 'lost her balance'. Actually, she had grabbed a handful of brake. The instructor did not correct her nor did he ascertain that she had learned anything from her mistake.

On the second range day she received very serious injuries when she lost control of her bike.

She lost her case in court. The program and its employees (and H-D and the MSF) claimed (and apparently believed) they did nothing wrong.

Oh, she could not touch the ground with the balls of both feet when sitting on the saddle - even with the low profile seat provided for the Blast.

Do you honestly think that kind of experience occurs in an MSF BRC?
Go to Top of Page

dhalen32
Male Moderator
841 Posts
[Mentor]


Omaha, NE
USA

BMW

R1200RT

Posted - 06/30/2014 :  5:14 PM
Jim:
I am really not trying to antagonize. As I said I work both sides of the aisle: Straight MSF classes and HDRA (formerly Rider's Edge) classes. In my personal experience HDRA classes are not 35X more dangerous than MSF classes. I also did not work the court case that you did. However, I certainly believe you that the woman was unable to touch the ground with both feet. I do see this in both types of classes so I guess the answer to your final question is: Yes, I honestly see it in MSF BRC classes.

I am as pleased as you with the direction that H-D is taking with HDRA and their new training bike and I do not want to dampen your enthusiasm for both of them. I feel an improvement is taking place. I was just urging caution that good coaching (opposed to bad, as asserted in your court case), a good range and good program management are more important than the program's name and an enthusiastic press release.

I cannot refute how you calculated your numbers because you have defined the criteria and you know the sources that you have for the data. I can only express my opinion based upon personally training thousands of new riders since 1992 in both MSF and Rider's Edge RSS, BRC and NRC classes.
Respectfully,
Dave
Go to Top of Page

TonicBIA
Male Senior Member
382 Posts


Arlington, Va
USA

Triumph

Sprint ST

Posted - 08/05/2014 :  9:49 AM
I agree with dhalen32. The safety of the program is entirely dependent on the
1.) Local site management
2.) Condition/layout of the range
3.) State administration of the program

In that order.

quote:
Originally posted by James R. Davis

[quote]Do you honestly think that kind of experience occurs in an MSF BRC?



Another RC chiming in here. Sadly, I've seen this on a regular basis. One of the sites I was recently asked to teach for has in my opinion, horrible coaches. Some of the things I've witnessed:
  • Adding their own personal exercises to the curriculum ex: practice jamming on the brake to know what it feels like so they won't do it again.
  • Student crashes next to them. Doesn't say anything. Student picks up bike, rides around, crashed again. Coach again doesn't say anything
  • Yells at student in first riding exercise (using the friction zone) for stalling. From 0 to 10
  • Briefs a 25 minute exercise for 10 minutes, lets them ride for 8 minutes, debriefs for 10 minutes


I witnessed some of the worst after I finished my Riders Academy Training where I'm told the creme of the creme teach. It's the same range, same management and same State program, but different bikes (street 500's are fun and interesting at the same time) & apparently the RC's that do RA classes are hand picked and have to show the ability and extra initiative expected to deal with customers that pay an additional $200 to be there.

I've declined any more regular BRCs to not have to coach with those with the mentality producing the list above, but may not continue at the site if conditions don't improve or if their "premium" coaches are the same as their BRC coaches.

At my regular site there are a few bad apples, but the site owners work to either improve them or show them the door... in which case they go to one of the other local programs desperate for coaches.

The problem about Virginia is the management of our statewide program was taken over by a for profit motorcycle training company about 5 years ago that moved all the Rider Coach Preperatory Classes (Trains new RiderCoaches) to Richmond Va. It's hard to get any new person interested in driving 100 miles through I-95 friday rush hour traffic to take the class a few weekends in a row. We barely get enough coaches to replace the ones that leave or retire from coaching. Some sites have even had to cancel classes due to a lack of good coaches. So in general we're faced with the dilemma or provide limited training or provide no training.
Go to Top of Page

gymnast
Moderator
4263 Posts
[Mentor]


Meridian, Idaho
USA

Harley-Davidson

Sportster Sport

Posted - 05/19/2015 :  12:15 PM
Some pictures, little info. http://www.latimes.com/business/aut...8-story.html

HD promo http://www.cycleworld.com/2015/05/0...nal-freedom/
Go to Top of Page
  Previous Topic Discussion Topic Next Topic  
Jump To:
All Things (Safety Oriented) Motorcycle © Master Strategy Group Go To Top Of Page
  This page was generated in 0.39 seconds. Powered By: Snitz Forums 2000 Version 3.4.05