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blank
 Junior Member
36 Posts
San Diego, CA
USA
BMW
2009 F 650 GS
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 Posted - 10/29/2008 : 11:11 PM
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So I will be getting my first bike any day now, and I'm looking at clothing/armor and I need some advice.
I live in San Diego, and the weather--even now--is very warm (85+). From my research, I've gathered that the best hot weather jacket/pants to get is the Joe Rocket Phoenix mesh jacket/pants.
Details here:
http://www.newenough.com/protective..._jacket.html
http://www.newenough.com/protective...erpants.html
Now, the jacket comes with back armor and CE-approved shoulder/elbow armor. The jacket is mesh and lightweight, and I'm concerned that it doesn't offer enough protection. There are a couple armor accessories I'm considering...
First, the BMW Back Protector 2 (http://www.webbikeworld.com/r3/back...k-protector/), which looks like it has a high comfort level, and seems pretty sturdy (as well as being Level 2 certified). This would, of course, be a replacement for the back armor in the Phoenix jacket.
The other option I'm considering is the Alpinestars Bionic S 2 Jacket (http://www.newenough.com/armor/elbo..._jacket.html) which is really more of a vest than a jacket. This would replace the back and shoulder armor of the Phoenix jacket, and it also has--albeit flimsy plastic and foam--chest protection.
So what do you all think? I don't want to waste my money and replace perfectly good armor on the Joe Rocket Phoenix jacket with just-as-good armor. But I'm worried that the jacket's armor isn't enough and isn't as secure/protective as the BMW or Alpinestars options. Is it? Is it a good idea to buy either the BMW Back Protector or the Alpinestars armor to wear under the Phoenix jacket?
Thank you ahead of time for your advice and insight!
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Edited by - blank on 10/29/2008 11:25 PM |
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jhaake
Standard Member
117 Posts
Marshallville, Ohio
USA
Suzuki
V-Strom DL650
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Posted - 10/29/2008 : 11:29 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by blank
Joe Rocket Phoenix mesh jacket/pants.
During my BRC(Beginning Rider Course) earlier this year (5000 miles under my belt since then) I was shown a gruesome photo during the classroom work of a person's arm who had slid down the road and the mesh had melted into the guy's arm. Brand name on the mesh jacket was visible: Joe Rocket. What was I wearing at the time this photo was shown -- my brand new Joe Rocket jacket.
My Joe Rocket jacket has served me very well this summer (never tested any of the safety features). It is hot enough that you will IMMEDIATELY want to get on the motorcycle and ride -- and there is the danger for me. Taking off to quick before I've check-pointed all the things I should have (helmet strap, engine warming, forgoten glasses etc etc). Heat+jacket = too much in a rush for me.
Welcome to the board -- read the tips here.
Good luck |
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blank
Junior Member
36 Posts
San Diego, CA
USA
BMW
2009 F 650 GS
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Posted - 10/29/2008 : 11:39 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by jhaake
quote:
Originally posted by blank
Joe Rocket Phoenix mesh jacket/pants.
What was I wearing at the time this photo was shown -- my brand new Joe Rocket jacket.
Oof!  That definitely makes an impression... what Joe Rocket jacket did you get? Is it the Phoenix?
Your post definitely makes me a little more weary of the mesh jacket...
Are there any other non-mesh jackets that offer good protection and ventilation in hot weather? |
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VodkaAndPickles
Advanced Member
589 Posts
Langhorne, PA
USA
Suzuki
Intruder 1500 LC
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Posted - 10/30/2008 : 12:24 AM
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I have a Joe Rocket Phoenix jacket. It flows air very well.
I think the stock back protector is actually more sturdy than most other stock back protectors. As for the melting mesh, I'm willing to trade some protection for a great increase in comfort. After all, there's no point in riding if you're uncomfortable to the point of hating it.
Still, there are probably better products out there, you just have to pay for them. I heard that the Motoport Kevlar gear is not hot in the summer and has significant protection, but it is expensive as hell. You can check them out. |
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Night Train
Moderator
1332 Posts
[Mentor]
Sydney, Nova Scotia
Canada
Harley-Davidson
03 Electra Glide Std
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Posted - 10/30/2008 : 6:19 AM
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Protective gear is no different than any other product. Some are better than others but one thing is certain, any are better than none. No brand of protective equipment is going to eliminate serious injury or death. but I believe it has been proven on countless occassions that utilizing such gear drastically reduces the severity of injury and can in fact save your life in most cases.
You can have the best that money can buy but it will not make you infallible. Protective equipment is simply one of many aspects that will maintain your safety at it's highest level.
When you look at a picture such as the one mentioned above with the jacket fibre imbedded into the skin, it shouldn't matter what brand jacket it was. I would rather try and think of where that arm would have been without a protective jacket. No doubt it would have been at some other location of the accident scene than where the rider came to rest.
My advice would be to wear the best gear you can afford but ride like you are naked.
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Niebor
Ex-Member
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Posted - 10/30/2008 : 6:25 AM
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I also wear the Joe Rocket mesh jacket. I suspect the photo V&P observed deaks with a rather extreme slide, the sort of slide you might expect from well, extreme speeds. If your dealing with the real-world, and real-world speeds, you'll very likely never test it to those limits.
I have no idea what the statistics are, but it seems far more likely "your slide will be much shorter, and end abruptly. In other words, you would more likely test both the abrasion and impact protection, to a lesser level. I believe the jacket is manufactured and tested to help protect at the median level.
If you ride to extremes, your gear should be designed to defend against extremes. You may want to consider a quality one or two piece leather riding suit. We have riders who, while not extreme riders, will not ride in anything less. Most of us compromise somewhere in the middle. Hence, the popularity of the Joe Rocket jacket. |
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biocoach
Senior Member
259 Posts
Falls Church, Va
USA
GAS GAS
280
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Posted - 10/30/2008 : 7:04 AM
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| Check out some of the other mesh jackets on the market. The one that comes to mind is the Cortech GX Air (pretty sure I have it right). It's mesh with leather on the parts that statistically get the most wear. I thought it actually flowed air better than my JR alter ego. |
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gdickelman
Moderator
1190 Posts
[Mentor]
Annandale, VA
USA
Moto Guzzi
California Vintage
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Posted - 10/30/2008 : 7:51 AM
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My first jacket was a neon yellow Olympia Airglide:
https://www.motoliberty.com/prod_de...?Prod_ID=252
It has served me well! With the liner out, it is appropriate for hot weather. It has the CE inserts (shoulders, back, elbows). When it gets chilly, the liner is great. You can also get Olympia pants that zip to the jacket (so that you are protected from the jacket riding up and exposing skin in a slide).
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jhaake
Standard Member
117 Posts
Marshallville, Ohio
USA
Suzuki
V-Strom DL650
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Posted - 10/30/2008 : 8:01 AM
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blank,
My first post about the mesh melting may have come across to negatively. I would agree with what the others have said here. The best armor is correct motorcycle technique and driving skills.
Also, I am very happy with my Joe Rocket jacket. The one thing I really like that my wife and kid's jackets lack is the belt loops to attach to my belt when I'm not wearing protective pants (more protective than jeans) those loops give me a bit of comfort I'm not going to slide down the road with my jacket bunched up at my neck. I really really like that feature of J.R.
I have protective pants but they are more for colder weather and they are a different brand (First Gear) they work nice with the jacket even though the J.R. jacket has a 6" zipper and the pants have an 8" zipper -- the zipper still works with the different brand (I tried this out in the store first).
John |
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River
Advanced Member
502 Posts
[Mentor]
West Lafayette, IN
USA
Kawasaki
Concours
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Posted - 10/30/2008 : 8:10 AM
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Heya,
I own the Motoport- specifically because of the heat issue. It's expensive, but I figure it'll last me a lifetime. I got the Air Mesh 2 and Pants to match. It's also nothing compared to the comfort level I have while wearing it.
http://www.motoport.com/Product.asp?Clv=102302
It is cool? YES. I have been surprised to find myself comfortable in the asphalt jungle over 90F and as long as there is even the slightest motion!
Standing still, well, with skin cancer threats and stuff, I'll take the protection & the shade.
Get the optional liner: In cool weather you'll want it.
In my photo, I'm wearing a mesh Olympia jacket. Haven't updated my photo. The difference between the two is palpable: not only is the motoport heavier, it is cooler.
Good luck on any decision you make!
^o^ |
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WarHawk
Advanced Member
1794 Posts
Baytown, Texas
USA
Yamaha
'07 V-Star Custom
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Posted - 10/30/2008 : 9:28 AM
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I aspire to have the finest gear money can buy...that I NEVER have to use!
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The Meromorph
Advanced Member
717 Posts
[Mentor]
White House, TN
USA
BMW
R1100R
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Posted - 10/30/2008 : 9:40 AM
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I have a Joe Rocket Phoenix 5 and an Olympia AST jacket.
The Olympia has CE armor in the elbows, shoulders and back.
The Joe Rocket has CE armor in the elbows and shoulders, and their own armor in the back. (they sell a replacement CE back protector for about $90).
I wear the Joe Rocket down to about 50 degrees and up to 100 or so.
I wear the Olympia down to any temp I've encountered so far (sub freezing) and up to 80 or so.
I choose which to wear based on the range I'll encounter that day. They can both be pushed beyond those ranges, but get uncomfortable. Those ranges are comfort ranges, rather than absolute limits.
CE armor is a certification you can trust, for street riding, certainly at sane speeds.
The Joe Rocket back protector is bigger, about as thick, and similar to the CE back armor, but has shoulder blade coverage and the Joe rocket has an extra pad (sealed in) at lower back level.
I regard them both as equally protective, but the Joe Rocket as a one-crash jacket, the Olympia AST as a multiple-crash jacket (possibly with repairs after each crash). I expect my Insurance to pay for the replacement or repair. |
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YoungAtHeart
Junior Member
79 Posts
Pleasant Hill, CA
USA
Harley-Davidson
'07 Softail Custom
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Posted - 10/30/2008 : 10:51 AM
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| Leather for me. Chaps, boots and jacket. Even if it's hot. |
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blank
Junior Member
36 Posts
San Diego, CA
USA
BMW
2009 F 650 GS
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Posted - 10/30/2008 : 11:00 AM
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Thank you for all of your wonderful feedback, everyone! I think I have been swayed away from mesh, after more reading of reviews and opinions about mesh jackets. The Motoport looks great, but it's a little too expensive for me, being a fresh college graduate in serious student loan debt 
What I'm thinking I might end up going with is the Cortech HRX Series 2 jacket (http://www.newenough.com/protective..._jacket.html). It has a good amount of leather and armor (all CE-approved, by the way), and mesh torso for the hot weather. I also like that it comes in white. Anyone have experience with this particular jacket?
I read a review on the Cortech GX Air, and it was pretty favorable (including 85 degree riding). The guy actually did a medium speed lowside in it, and the jacket looks (from the photos) like it held up very well. Here's a link to the review with photos: http://www.motorcycleaddicts.org/te...-gx-air.html
The Cortech HRX Series 2 jacket seems like it has more armor/leather (and CE-approved back armor) than the GX Air, so that's what I'll probably go with. The price seems decent, too.
Thanks again for all the great feedback and insight, everybody. It is very much appreciated in the fullest!  |
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House_of_Dexter
Standard Member
167 Posts
Richardson, Tx
USA
Kawasaki
2007 Ex-500
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Posted - 10/30/2008 : 11:23 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by blank
So I will be getting my first bike any day now, and I'm looking at clothing/armor and I need some advice.
I live in San Diego, and the weather--even now--is very warm (85+). From my research, I've gathered that the best hot weather jacket/pants to get is the Joe Rocket Phoenix mesh jacket/pants.
Heh...It gets warm in San Diego? I just went through 100F+ in North Texas...wearing Full Textile...and I see lots of riders around here wearing Full Leather in 100F+ weather...Your body does get use to the weather...Once it dropped to 95F and lower I stopped using my Core Cooler (Water Evaporation Vest)...
Oh yeah...Wearing Joe Rocket Alter Ego Jacket and JR Ballistic Pants, Full Face Helmet, and gloves... |
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blank
Junior Member
36 Posts
San Diego, CA
USA
BMW
2009 F 650 GS
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Posted - 10/30/2008 : 11:47 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by House_of_Dexter
Heh...It gets warm in San Diego? I just went through 100F+ in North Texas.
Hey, give me a break! I lived in Seattle my whole life until I moved down here to San Diego in April. I'm not used to not having any seasons, yet... 
The Alter Ego looks nice, but I like the thought of some leather being present, too, as with the Cortech. |
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Beary
Standard Member
179 Posts
Edmond, Oklahoma
USA
Harley-Davidson
Road King Classic
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Posted - 10/30/2008 : 3:25 PM
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I have a Pheonix and it has so much armor on it, I'm trying imagine how far a person would have to skip along the ground to have the kind of injury described. It has some really good armor that protects quite a bit of the body and it does a great job of staying cool in the 95+ degree Oklahoma Heat.
The title of the thread is "how much is too much?" But I think we have to be careful about down playing good equipment just because it is not the best. Lets face it, many average folks will choose to ride with no armor if armor cost too much. A jacket like the Pheonix is around $100 and that is pretty good value for pretty good protection. A leather jacket for around the same money doesn't have any armor and I doubt would hold up as good in the same accident.
Beary |
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blank
Junior Member
36 Posts
San Diego, CA
USA
BMW
2009 F 650 GS
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Posted - 10/30/2008 : 4:09 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Beary
I have a Pheonix and it has so much armor on it, I'm trying imagine how far a person would have to skip along the ground to have the kind of injury described. It has some really good armor that protects quite a bit of the body
Beary
Thanks for your insight Beary. What is it about that armor that gives you the impression that it would stand up against some pavement surfing? Is it the armor in the shoulders, elbows, and back that would do it? It's hard to imagine the poly/mesh shell being terribly abrasion resistant. It's hard to tell in the photos I've seen of the Phoenix, but are the backs of the arms
textile as opposed to simply mesh?
Although I haven't entirely decided quite yet about what jacket I'm going to get, the HRX Series 2 seems to go that extra step with the leather panels and hard-molded external shoulder protectors...
(I probably should have given this thread a different title... protective Summer jackets, or something... oh well) |
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VodkaAndPickles
Advanced Member
589 Posts
Langhorne, PA
USA
Suzuki
Intruder 1500 LC
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Posted - 10/30/2008 : 4:16 PM
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You can also check out Draggin' shirts and pants. They are made out of Kevlar for abrasion resistance.
http://www.dragginjeans.com
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blank
Junior Member
36 Posts
San Diego, CA
USA
BMW
2009 F 650 GS
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Posted - 10/30/2008 : 4:27 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by VodkaAndPickles
You can also check out Draggin' shirts and pants. They are made out of Kevlar for abrasion resistance.
http://www.dragginjeans.com
Nice! I was unaware of Draggin'. Thanks for the tip. 
I think if I were to wear the Draggin' Shirt underneath the Phoenix jacket, I would be satisfied, as well as the Draggin' Liners underneath the Phoenix pants. Abrasion is what worries me the most with the mesh jacket/pants, but wearing the Draggin' Kevlar underneath seems like it would be a perfect combination with mesh. |
Edited by - blank on 10/30/2008 4:47 PM |
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The Meromorph
Advanced Member
717 Posts
[Mentor]
White House, TN
USA
BMW
R1100R
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Posted - 10/30/2008 : 5:19 PM
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The Joe Rocket has solid textiles at all the key points.
CE armor is as good as you need. That's a meaningfull standard.
I've seen ride reports from people who crashed in the Joe Rocket jacket at up to 60 or 70 mph, and they were delighted with the protection. The jacket needed replacing, afterwards though. You also stand a chance of getting a previous years model very cheap.
I don't feel unsafe in it at all. |
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Clothing and armor--how much is too much?