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 Negligence and stupidity - the same thing?
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James R. Davis
Male Administrator
17283 Posts
[Mentor]


Houston, TX
USA

Honda

GoldWing 1500

Posted - 02/21/2017 :  3:08 PM Follow poster on Twitter  Join poster on Facebook as Friend  
Bravo! You took too long to decide to leave, but you finally did so.

Releases may be of some value, but I've seen too many of them tossed out in court to have much confidence in them.

When you find a disciplined and safety conscious group to ride with, group rides are terrific. How does a newbie find such a group and how does he learn that his safety is EVERYTHING, thus enabling a departure from the group decision before it's too late?
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SkootchNC
Male Advanced Member
1063 Posts
[Mentor]


raleigh, north carolina
USA

Harley-Davidson

road glide

Posted - 02/22/2017 :  7:58 AM
quote:
Originally posted by James R. Davis

How does a newbie find such a group and how does he learn that his safety is EVERYTHING, thus enabling a departure from the group decision before it's too late?



Rule number one.... pay attention
Does the ride meet at a bar, and are the stops at bars?
(YES...folks can and do meet at bars, and even have lunch at a bar, without drinking...but when you see bars a meeting and or stopping places... observe those around you.

if one is a novice, with that group... speak to the ride leader... if they address your concerns, they are likely "OK" if the dismiss your concerns...probably a good sign to leave

Is there a pre-ride meeting, going over the route? and hand signals? is it an escorted ride?

Pat attention to those riding around you...are they maintaining a smooth pace, or is there a constant "rubber band" effect... Are they jostling around from column to column?

Does the group go single file when entering a curvy section?

all those, and more... ultimately the only person who is concerned for YOUR safety... is you... if it doesn't feel right.. leave... be polite, there is no point in critiquing the group...

Getting back to the original post(s)

The group was very familiar with each other and rode as a group often.

I have to wonder if this sort of confusion on the part of rider # 2 is typical? or whether Rider #2 was having an "issue day"
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James R. Davis
Male Administrator
17283 Posts
[Mentor]


Houston, TX
USA

Honda

GoldWing 1500

Posted - 02/22/2017 :  10:18 AM Follow poster on Twitter  Join poster on Facebook as Friend  
Based on the fact that only one month earlier he dumped his bike to avoid a collision, it's hard to imagine that the day of the accident was unique.I think he had 'bad days' with some regularity.

But because the group was all familiar with each other, the real question in my mind is why anybody would ride in the group if he was a part of it. And why didn't anyone try to convince him that crashing to avoid a crash means CRASHING, and at least one more problem: what about his riding INVITES close calls?
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greywolf
Male Moderator
1492 Posts
[Mentor]


Evanston, IL
USA

Suzuki

DL650AL2

Posted - 02/22/2017 :  11:50 AM
Saying "I had to lay it down" twice in one year really means "I don't know how to properly brake, steer or avoid situations requiring either, so I crash a lot."
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Mikeydude
Male Advanced Member
742 Posts
[Mentor]


Ft. Worth, Texas
USA

Harley-Davidson

03 FXD Super Glide

Posted - 02/22/2017 :  2:28 PM
James... I totally agree with you about the crashing to avoid a crash is a dumb idea however, when I was a much younger rider in the 70s 'laying it down' was an acceptable strategy. The thought being, it's better to have the bike hit the obstacle (car, curb, etc...) first. The thought that hitting the ground first is still a crash never enters the equation. The sad thing is that I know people that still think that way, and there's no convincing them otherwise.

And sadly these same people think that the best strategy when hitting an animal is imminent is to accelerate.

For me, I don't want to ride in a group unless I know how every member rides in a small group of 2 or 3 bikes at most, first. And the Road Captain needs to be very experienced and not just "the guy with the map."


And you're right... I should've bailed on that ride earlier. Like when hot-shot passed me on the shoulder and bullied me into a different slot (we need a thumbs up emote... lol).
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